A few important questions

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This topic contains 6 replies, has 4 voices, and was last updated by  LARobert 5 years, 4 months ago.

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  • #1986

    Deeown
    Member

    in school today we learned about the middle ages and what not, and as we all know the Catholic Church was basically the only unifying structure left after Rome fell.

    it seems like they did many bad things, from indulgences to preaching that priests have the power to forgive sin…

    why did the Church do these things? is it not infallible? how can they possibly preach that by buying an indulgence you get out of purgatory…

    #9646

    Andres Ortiz
    Keymaster
    #9647

    LARobert
    Participant

    There are all sorts of issues I have with what and the way you were taught this history. There are many common misconceptions about the Catholic Church.

    First until the 11th Century there was only one Church, After that time the schism which gives us the separation between the various Orthodox Churches, which are for the most part drawn on national lines, and the Catholic Church which has both Eastern and Latin (Western Rites) all unified with the Pope. All the historic, or Apostolic Churches (Orthodox, Armenian Apostolic and Catholic) as well as a the Monophocite Groups like the Copic, Ethiopian, and some Syrian Churches believe (as laid down in scripture) that Jesus gave the Apostles the authority to forgive sin in His name. They also believe that the Apostles passed on this authority to those they ordained by the laying on of hands. So it is not a new teaching of the Catholic Church that developed over time, but is traced back to the Apostles and the Bible.

    Infallibility is often confused with Impeccability. Impeccability is the belief that a person can never sin. The Church does not claim that for anyone from the Pope on down. Infalliblity as the Church sees it is that when the Church teaches officially to all Christians in the world on a matter of Faith or Morals, God grants that they will not teach error. This is manifest in three different ways. Extrodinary, When the Pope declares something officially to be a doctrine, or moral decision, and he does so to the ENTIRE CHURCH, in the FULLNESS of his Apostolic Authority, making it clear that it is binding on all Christians. Most theologians can only point out this having happened twice in the entire 2000 years of Church History. Another way the Church teaches infallibly is when the bishops all meet in a council, and the council decisions (on faith and morals) are affirmed by the Pope. The third is when any bishop or priest united with the Pope teaches what the Church teaches.

    In the case of indulgences and other things that people in the Church did, that was not an infallible action. The fact is that the Church forbids and did forbid the sale of any holy thing, ie Sacraments, Indulgences or blessings, as the sin of Simony (after Simon who wanted to buy the power to heal from the Apostles) If an individual or group teaches something contrary to what the Church teaches, as J. Tetzel did, it is he and not the entire Church that is in error. If the Pope speaks on the subject of Quantum Physics, (Not a matter of Faith you know) or to a small group of people about his personal theological opinions, he can because he is speaking as a private individual, and not in his official position as Pope, make an error, and is not protected by the charism of Infallibility. Like everyone else in the Church the Pope, and all the Bishops, priests and deacons are humans, who sin, and err, who need to go to confession, and be sorry for their sins.

    #9648

    LARobert
    Participant

    Catholic teaching on the priest forgiving sins.

    As posted in the last post, the authority was given by Jesus to the Apostles, (as we read in the Bible) the Apostles passed on their authority by the laying on of hands to others, (also read in the Bible)

    Priests do so in the name of, or by the Authority given them by Jesus, our High Priest. So while the priest has the authority, or as some would call it, “power” to forgive sins, they are doing so, by Jesus authority. Each of the Sacraments the Catholic Church teaches, is not a work of man, it is not the priest who supplies the graces, but Jesus who supplies the graces through His priesthood. So the forgiveness that the priest has the authority to grant, comes primarily and ultimatly from Jesus.

    Many Protestants say, “I go directly to God”. That’s fine to say, but that is not how Jesus set things up. If he did not want us to submit to His will and the authority of the Church, why would he clearly establish the Church (as we read in Scripture) why would he give the Apostles the authority to forgive sins? Why would he command that they go out to the ends of the earth preaching the Gospel and Baptizing all those who hear and accept the Gospel. (There are Protestant sects who reject what Jesus said, by teachingt that all you have to do is “Accept Jesus into your heart as Lord and Savior” but reject the need for baptism, which Jesus told His Apostles they were to do. He said, “Go therefore and teach, baptizing in the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.” Not let anyone believe in me and leave it at that.

    #9649

    Deeown
    Member
    "LARobert":22qr1enn wrote:
    Catholic teaching on the priest forgiving sins.

    As posted in the last post, the authority was given by Jesus to the Apostles, (as we read in the Bible) the Apostles passed on their authority by the laying on of hands to others, (also read in the Bible)

    Priests do so in the name of, or by the Authority given them by Jesus, our High Priest. So while the priest has the authority, or as some would call it, “power” to forgive sins, they are doing so, by Jesus authority. Each of the Sacraments the Catholic Church teaches, is not a work of man, it is not the priest who supplies the graces, but Jesus who supplies the graces through His priesthood. So the forgiveness that the priest has the authority to grant, comes primarily and ultimatly from Jesus.

    Many Protestants say, “I go directly to God”. That’s fine to say, but that is not how Jesus set things up. If he did not want us to submit to His will and the authority of the Church, why would he clearly establish the Church (as we read in Scripture) why would he give the Apostles the authority to forgive sins? Why would he command that they go out to the ends of the earth preaching the Gospel and Baptizing all those who hear and accept the Gospel. (There are Protestant sects who reject what Jesus said, by teachingt that all you have to do is “Accept Jesus into your heart as Lord and Savior” but reject the need for baptism, which Jesus told His Apostles they were to do. He said, “Go therefore and teach, baptizing in the Name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost.” Not let anyone believe in me and leave it at that.[/quote:22qr1enn]
    I see. well what if i have a dilema…i am not baptized yet and i am 16 years old. i want to be but i have not yet because my family simply cant afford it….im Armenian and when i get baptized its gonna be a huge thing a party and stuff and plus a donation to the church and we just cant afford it right now…what if God forbid i died today…would i go to hell for not being baptized?

    #9651

    James
    Member
    "Deeown":1yi75ca8 wrote:
    would i go to hell for not being baptized?[/quote:1yi75ca8]
    You will be judged by our Lord just like everyone else, baptized or not. It is only Him that his judgement will be final.
    #9652

    LARobert
    Participant

    You can talk to the priest in your parish. While the customs of Eastern Catholics and Orthodox include a big party surrounding the baptism of children (Usually ages one or two). He can discuss with you the reasons why you want to be baptized and also speak with your parents on the greater importance of the Sacrament and lesser importance of the party and public display. Your case is not the first time this would have happened, and the priest would know best how to approach the situation.

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