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Well Your reasoning isn’t inspired now is it !!! For 3 verses of Scriptures which is inspired, tells us 1 – Rom 10:17- So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God.
2 – 1 Pet 2:2 – As newborn babes, desire the sincere milk of the word, that ye may grow thereby:
3 – John 8:31+32 – Then said Jesus to those Jews which believed on him, If ye continue in my word, then are ye my disciples indeed; And ye shall know the truth, and the truth shall make you free.
So if we get faith through His Word and grow in His word and know the truth with His word – Then His Word is complete to make me be able to be prepared for all things (Which is exactly what 2 Timothy 3:16-17 says) So
what about Yoouuurrrrr “opinions!”

Once again, Ron, you not only failed to interact with my argument, you came up with a bunch of drivel that has nothing to do with it. Christianity does not require an abandoning of reason and logic, and yet you have abandoned both.

[quote:26zll0r1]Miracles is one thing, Forgiveness or removal of sins is another different area that no man can do – That is what you’ve been conditioned to think[/quote:26zll0r1]

Once again, no response. God forgives sins THROUGH certain people. It is still God forgiving the sins, and you refuse to understand this. You are so wrong about everything that it is pointless to talk to you. If I said “White is white” you would say “No it isn’t”. There is no way to argue with that. You are simply saying things that are wrong. Only God can perform miracles, yet He performs them through others. Only God forgives sins, yet He can do it through others. Your position is untenable.

I know what it doesn’t say – and I know what His plan is according to His Word – You just don’t understand it – or you simply deny it.

Once again, Ron, you have no argument, no stand, no reason at all for your beliefs. I am growing tired of this.

[quote:26zll0r1]The gates of Hell hasn’t prevailed against His Church but yours? – you pray to saints, preach Purgatory, Penances for sin, talk of a “real presence” in the Eucharist, have mass, – Hummmmm? Looks like Satan’s done quite well with your church. [/quote:26zll0r1]

Again, your arguments are invalid. In a court of law, this argument would be thrown out for being prejudicial and non substantial. It is an argument ad captandum–meant to prejudice those listening. Unfortunately for you, in this particular discussino, there aren’t any other anti catholic fundamentalists to prejudice, so the argument is even MORE useless.

We have already shown how prayer to the Saints is valid and you were helpless to prove otherwise. Purgatory is simply an obvious solution to the problem of what happens to righteous but imperfect men after death, as well as being clearly propounded in the Bible. the Real Presence of Christ in the Eucharist is so obvious in the bible that only a blind or severly biased individual could explain it away. Your argument is once again hollow.

[quote:26zll0r1]Oh the venial sin point of which I forgot to mention – Yet James says If you commit one sin, you are guilty of all and Rev 21:27 says no sin is ever going to Heaven – so which sins are only “venial?”[/quote:26zll0r1]

Once again you make my argument for me. If some sins are not deadly (and some aren’t. John specificall says so) what happens to the man who dies with venial sin? He is purged of it as by fire.

[quote:26zll0r1]As to the Catholic that does or doesn’t go to Heaven, you’ve said that Catholics are His Church,[/quote:26zll0r1]

I said the Catholic Church is His Church. It is only your preconceived ideas of what a Church should be that is making you put words in my mouth.

[quote:26zll0r1]so then which ones go to Heaven or which ones don’t. [/quote:26zll0r1]

The ones justified by God will go to Heaven.

[quote:26zll0r1]Surely you don’t think if someone partakes in daily mass and by sacramental methods someone can merit their salvation[/quote:26zll0r1]

No, I don’t. Meriting salvation is impossible. We are saved by God’s merciful Grace. We also have to do our part though, which is why we must show faith and have works.

[quote:26zll0r1]I’m just showing that His Church consists only of Believers, not some denomination [/quote:26zll0r1]

The Church isn’t “some denomination”. It is THE CHURCH that Christ always spoke about.


read it again for I don’t think he says that we shouldn’t or couldn’t understand Scriptures

He says we shouldn’t privately interpret them, EXACTLY as you are doing. Peter is giving us a warning of poeple exactly like you!

[quote:26zll0r1]That is only because you don’t see their mistakes.[/quote:26zll0r1]

Of course anyone can make mistakes. But the magisterium, or the Pope when speaking infallibly, do not make mistakes.

Then I guess I’ll stop casting my pearls your way

You have no pearls to cast.

Thank you but you still continue to double talk as in saying “the real institution, the Catholic Church” that is your opinion, not a fact as I can show you but you don’t have the eyes to see or the ears to hear either.

I am making no double talk at all. You don’t even understand the words you are proclaiming. I have never said anything OTHER than the fact that the Church is a real institution. The only rason protestants don’t want it to be so is because they know that if it is, just like Jesus and Paul and all of the Apostles proclaimed, then the reformation is a sham, because Jesus’ Church couldn’t be founded fifteen hundred years after He said it was.

I can assure you that I will never be a Catholic – been there, and repented of that, so why would I want to go back? No need to answer this question.[/quote:26zll0r1]

you have never been a Catholic. Even if you were in name, you clearly did not and do not understand ANY of its dogmas and doctrines. And, in what is oh so wildly surprising (/sarcasm), you failed to engage my mention of Matthew 16: 15-19 because there is nothing for you say. Jesus founded a Church, He founded it on Peter, and it lives to this day, in the form of the Catholic Church.

I will not respond to any more of your posts Ron. You do nothing but spout anti catholic gibberish and I refuse to waste my time talking with one whose mind is anti-logical, anti-reasoning, and extremely anti catholic. You make no attempt to understand what we are saying, you make no attempt to understand our doctrines, and you make no attempt to even defend your own traditions of men, because they are indefensible.

I simply will not continue. This is fruitless and it isn’t helping anything. Have a pleasent evening.