Home Forums All Things Catholic I am Catholic, my brother is not. Reply To: I am Catholic, my brother is not.

"LARobert":hqjb1bj2 wrote:
Just happened upon this before taking the dogs our for their last walk of the night.

When both the husband and the wife are baptized Christians, this natural marriage takes on the element of sacramentality. A marriage between baptized persons is a sacrament, a visible sign of God’s love in the world. This means that the couple finds in their relationship a source of God’s grace, and through their partnership they assist one another in coming closer to God.

By the very fact that both the husband and the wife are baptized, their marriage becomes a sacrament. It is not a matter of where the wedding takes place or who officiates at the ceremony. Whether marriage is a sacrament is completely based upon the baptismal status of the parties.
http://www.catholiceducation.org/articl … f0044.html

Please read through the entire page. Happily it was taken from an article in Envoy magazine by two of the presenters at the Conference I attended. I do have to correct my previous posting, it was the Canon Lawyer who has his Doctorate in Canon Law, that is a priest, not the Licenciate.
Hi LARobert,
this was in reply to a specific question:
“If you are trying to determine whether you need an annulment, these explanations may be helpful”

This would be for people entering into marriage through the Church who may have been in a previous marriage outside the Church.

It speaks of natural marriage, two people who vow to to remain Love and loyal to each other, outside the Church.

Which from your reference would place as sacramental between two baptized peoples (Man and Woman). Sacramental which is based on the baptismal status of the couple.

I am okay with that, and it is understandable, however when two choose/ refuse not to marry in the Church, that is frowned upon.

Pope John Paul II Humanae Vitae;
The human person is a union of body and soul. Only God can bring into existence the immortal and spiritual soul of the human person. Referring to this truth of faith, the Catholic Catechism says: “The Church teaches that every spiritual soul is created immediately by God — it is not produced by the parents.”

Consequently, contraceptive acts are a negation of the honor due to the Creator since by engaging in them a married couple seek to impede any possible creative intervention by God.

Your reference is from Jacqueline Rapp, JD, JCL and Pete Vere, JCL. “Do I Need and Annulment? ” Envoy (November, 2003). Who happens to be a convert from the Protestant Church.


At the bottom of the Page:
Not all articles published on CERC are the objects of official Church teaching, but these are supplied to provide supplementary information.

What the Catholic Church ‘Binds and looses is bound on Earth as in heaven,” regardless of how man reacts to it.

This discussion had come up in my Parish Church awhile ago, and that’s how I came to the Pope John Paul II’s letter, I dug it up to back a Local Priests statement, In which He stated “The Church recognizes the commitment made but not the marriage.”

For a Catholic to Marry outside the church without a dispensation, has to be addressed for him/ her to receive the Sacraments, even to another baptized person.

Contraception practices have made Trial marriages, living together, even civil marriages of convenience all to common.

Even divorced Catholics who remarry outside the Church are

“are unable to be admitted thereto from the fact that their state and condition of life objectively contradict that union of love between Christ and the Church which is signified and effected by the Eucharist.”

It just seems to say that any marriage between two baptized persons is Sacramental is a generalization which can be taken out of the context it is written in.

The Catholic Church before the Reformation, from your reference of the Counsel of Florence wasn’t addressing instances which it could not foresee.

After the reformation well the Counsel of Trent affirmed Catholic teachings which the protestants would deny. The issues dealing with the status of those born into different religions til Vatican II.

So unless your gonna tell me the Pope is wrong in his encyclical from 1981. The Church recognizes the commitment a couple has made to each other, however, marrying outside of any church in

Civil marriages, marriages outside the church are just a few ways to get around dealing with the truth and teachings of the church, for catholics and the World.

http://www.vatican.va/holy_father/john_ … io_en.html

entering in a marriage and planning to use contraception would negate the ‘sacramental’ considerations of the Church.

Again it is the intent of each party that makes it a Sacramental, In God. Marrying civilly is doing so outside of God especially between two baptized persons.

I’ll Take John Paul II’s letter over a former protestant Convert, Canon Lawyer any day!

God bless,