[quote:qpksqb86]Weathers lets not forget what we were referring to! Your initial question was:
[quote:qpksqb86]
[b:qpksqb86]So Ron,what your saying is forget the “saints”there doing nothing for us?[/b:qpksqb86][/quote:qpksqb86]
you and I are referring to those in Heaven, so lets not presume that what you now say:
[quote:qpksqb86]
So if I follow your way of thinking if someone is seriously ill or needs allot of prayers you should not have people pray to God to make you better cause thats intercedeing is that correct? I wonder what all these pray groups are doing when they pray for sick people(is it for naught)?.[/quote:qpksqb86]
this is not mentioning about those in Heaven, so it isn’t my way of thinking! I never said that we cannot pray for others as long as we are on Earth.[/quote:qpksqb86]
[color=red:qpksqb86]Ron,this is from a Lutheran website[/color:qpksqb86]
How did Martin Luther and the Lutheran Confessions answer the question, “Who are the saints?” Because Martin Luther and the Lutheran Confessions based all Christian teaching on the Scriptures alone, it is not surprising that their teaching on saints mirrors those Scriptures. Because the Lutherans also considered themselves faithful [color=red:qpksqb86]catholics,[/color:qpksqb86] it is not surprising that they were willing to retain all sound teaching about saints from the [color=red:qpksqb86]ancient Church[/color:qpksqb86].
When the question, “Who are the saints” is asked, the Lutheran Confessions answered, [color=red:qpksqb86]”All believers in Jesus Christ, both those living on earth and those living in heaven.” Both heavenly and earthly saints are confessed. [/color:qpksqb86]
The Lutherans also regarded Christians in heaven as saints and were even willing to honor those that the [color=red:qpksqb86]Roman Church regarded as saints[/color:qpksqb86], but in a qualified way. As the Apology puts it, “Our Confession approves honors to the saints. For here a threefold honor is to be approved” (Apology 21.4). The threefold honor is to thank God for the mercy and gifts He manifested in the saints, to be encouraged by the forgiveness they received through Christ when they fell (e.g., Peter’s denials), to imitate their faith and virtues. If we were to use the saints in this way, we would truly honor them, says the Apology.
All Saints Day is a universal Christian Feast that honors and remembers all Christian saints, known and unknown. In the Western Church (esp. Roman Catholics, Lutherans, Anglicans) it is kept on November 1. The Orthodox Churches observe it on the first Sunday after Pentecost.
Ephrem Syrus (d. 373) mentions a Feast dedicated the saints in his writings. St. Chrysostom of Constantinople (d. 407) was the first Christian we know of to assign the Feast to a particular day: the first Sunday after Pentecost.1 The Feast did not become established in the Western Church, however, until the Roman bishop Boniface IV consecrated the Pantheon at Rome to Christian usage as a church on May 13, 609 or 610.2 The Feast was observed annually on this date until the time of Bishop of Rome, Gregory III (d. 741) when its observance was shifted to Nov. 1, since on this date Gregory dedicated a chapel in the Basilica of St. Peter’s to “All the Saints.” It was Gregory IV (d. 844), who in 835 ordered the Feast of All Saints to be universally observed on Nov. 1.3
As mentioned above, All Saints Day is celebrated by Roman Catholics, the Orthodox, Anglicans, and [color=red:qpksqb86]Lutherans[/color:qpksqb86] However, because of their differing understandings of the identity and function of the saints, what these churches do on the Feast of All Saints differs widely. For Roman Catholics, the Orthodox, and to some extent, Anglicans,[color=red:qpksqb86] All Saints is a day to remember, thank God for, but also to venerate and pray to the saints in heaven for various helps[/color:qpksqb86]. For Lutherans the day is observed by remembering and thanking God for all saints, both dead and living. It is a day to glorify Jesus Christ, who by his holy life and death has made the saints holy through Baptism and faith.