March 20, 2007 at 8:41 pm #1607
This is an [u:3i685gi6]excellent [/u:3i685gi6]video of why we are Catholic.
[b:3i685gi6]Why am I Catholic?[/b:3i685gi6]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0nSjxDKJEoMarch 20, 2007 at 10:47 pm #7910
[color=darkred:2cnu66el]Tradition was certainly a huge motivator for me coming back into the Church. ” title=”Smile” /> [/color:2cnu66el]March 20, 2007 at 11:25 pm #7912
[quote:1ewwplee][color=darkred:1ewwplee]Tradition was certainly a huge motivator for me coming back into the Church. ” title=”Smile” /> [/color:1ewwplee][/quote:1ewwplee]
Same here.[/color:1ewwplee]March 21, 2007 at 12:47 am #7915
Tradition is always a big stumblng block for other religions especially Lutherans or Protestant’s,They always say Catholics believe to much in Tradition,what is wrong with it?I don’t see anything wrong believing in it.April 7, 2007 at 10:38 pm #8009
[color=darkblue:1njul26s]I think they simply choose to be ignorant.[/color:1njul26s]April 9, 2007 at 4:02 pm #8015
I don’t think it is a choice to be ignorant. In fact they are taught to fear tradition as something evil. A misreading of the Traditions of Men, vs those things that Christ instructed the Apostles in. In the Gospels we read that after our Lord spoke to the crowds he took the Apostles aside and taught them further, explaining more fully what he had just taught to the crowds. What He told them was not recorded in the Scriptures, but passed down from the Apostles to their successors, those they laid hands on, and appointed to be the first Bishops and priests of the Church.
We can see that they believed they had authority not to innovate, or create new doctrines, but they felt comfortable in fully fleshing out what our Lord had instructed them in. For example the creation of Deacons. This was an act that the Apostles did on their own, something they obviously felt that they had the authority to do.
Our Lord ordained the Apostles when on Holy Thursday He instructed them to do what He did at the last supper, (take bread and wine, thank the Father, and bless it, so that it would become His body and blood) He later laid hands on them and breathed on them and told them they now had the authority to forgive sins, (Something until that time only He, the Father and the Holy Ghost had the authority to do.) He shared His authority with them. When the Annanias and Saphrriah lied to the Apostles it was found to be equivalent of lying to the Holy Ghost. Why, because they where intrusted with the authority given them (by virtue of the office they now held, as they remained men, capable of sin and error) so to lie to them was the same as trying to conseal the truth from the Holy Ghost. Why because they had been given an office that had authority and based on the dignity of the office, where did that dignity come from? From Christ who gave them the office, and instilled the dignity into that office. What you may ask does this have to do with Tradition, as it is clearly Biblical (thus far) you may ask. As a foundation for the Authority given to the Church in the office of the Bishop, I have laid down the basic authority of the Bishop
from the New Testament. (There are numerous other Bibilical citations that could be added, but I think those above are enough for now.) We combine that with the Scriptures in which St. Paul tells his desciples to “Hold fast to the Traditions that I have taught you.” and we see there are two different Traditions that the Bible speaks of. Holy Tradition, that taught by Christ to the Apostles, and from the Apostles to their successors, later when times of persecution had calmed. The second the Traditions of Men, rejected by the Church. The Traditions of Men can be found in the teachings of heretical sects that arose, for example the Gnostics.April 10, 2007 at 4:11 am #8016
I was once asked why I am Catholic on a Fundamentalist Evangelical board. When I posted the above quote, I was almost banned.April 28, 2007 at 3:02 am #8082
[color=darkblue:6htgbgpc]The CCC talks about unintentional ignorance, which means their is intentional ignorance. People can choose to be ignorant.[/color:6htgbgpc]April 28, 2007 at 4:43 am #8087
[quote:2j0m3tpd]The CCC talks about unintentional ignorance, which means their is intentional ignorance. People can choose to be ignorant.[/quote:2j0m3tpd]
The old term, (and my the ones I prefer) are Vincible and Invincible Ignorance. Examples of someone with Invincible Ignorance are…
1. Aboriginal People who have not had the Gospel preached to them.
2. People who have been brought up in an enviornment that is so
anti-Catholic that they cannot hear the rationality of the Truth as
given to us by Christ to the Apostles and from them handed down
through the centuries in the Church.
3. People with Mental Disorders or those with Developmental Disabilites
who cannot understand the Truth.
4. Catholics who have been improperly catechised and lose the faith
by members of number 2 or other false religions.
These God will deal with based on what they knew, (God has shown himself through creation and men know through the Natural Law sometimes called natural theology, the basics of proper behavior) theologians have speculated that they will either be given the truth when they die, and will be allowed the choice of accepting God or Rejecting Him, or that they will be judged based on what they know. God has not revealed that to us, and we must trust in His mercy. What we do know is that it is not their false beliefs that will save them but the Merits of Christ distributed through the Church in the Treasury of Graces that our Lord earned for the world through His Incarnation, Passion, Death and Rising from the dead.
An example of Vincible Ignorance would be someone who has all the opportunities to learn about the Faith, has rejected the truth through his own sloth and lack of interest in learning and practicing the Faith.
Now we may not know just what category someone is in. The devil himself may have used the bad example of a person professing to be a Catholic who harmed a soul and psyche of a person so deeply that without prayer (from all of us) and themselves to seek out the truth and their willingness to be open to the truth they may not be able to come to or come back to the faith. We don’t know if it is pride. There was a man who wrote a book called the People’s Padre, (Emmett McLoughin) a Franciscan priest who after years of good work as a priest fell in love with a woman, left the Church and was able to support himself by writing and selling books against Clerical Celebacy among other allegations against the Church. What most people don’t know is near the end of his life, he realized that his hormones where more important to him than his soul, and he went to confession and died in the embrace of Christ and His Church. I was very fortunate to speak with the priest who recieved him back, (and while of course he was unable to reveal what he confessed, Fr. Martin assured me that Emmet had made his peace with Christ, confessed and was able to recieve Extreme Unction and the Viaticum.) So one never knows the disposition of someone’s soul nor can we judge them. Had Fr. Martin not been able to go to Emmet’s bedside, Emmet could have made an act of perfect contrition and still died in the graces of communion with the Chruch.
Human pride is another factor, someone may be so angry at the Church, or be dependent on their livelyhood by speaking against the Church and have made statements so brash that they would feel like a fool if they admitted that what they yelled so loud from the rooftops was true and they “knew it for sure” was false, that they may be afraid to admit that what they said against the Church was false and not have the humility to come back home. There may be psychological factors too. Some people are so invested in being the only one who knows what is right that they just can’t admit when they have been duped and go along even fooling themselves.
What can we do as Catholics? First pray for them. Second pray for ourselves that we may remain faithful and not just learn our Faith, but live our Faith, following the spiritual path toward perfection. (our Lord bid us to be perfect as His Father in heaven is perfect.) A tall order, and one we may not accomplish until we are in heaven, but a goal to aim for each day. We can remember to practice the Corporal and Spiritual Works of Mercy. Trust in God and all He has revealed to us, by reading the Sacred Scriptures, the Lives and writings of the Saints, which while not Scripture serve as examples of those (spiritual family members) who trusted in God. In reading about the saints we find those who lived a life of grace from infancy and early childhood, to those who rejected God and sought after the world before their conversion. Examples for everyone. This is just the tip of the iceberg (so to speak)May 29, 2007 at 3:31 am #8412
I was a protestant, i’ve reccently becoming Catholic. I feel more connected to God when the wonder of my mind rests on Catholic Doctrines. I am still a learner but I find myself feel at home in Catholic.May 29, 2007 at 4:15 am #8415
Welcome Visible. Both to the Board, and the Body of Christ.
I’ve been meaning to ask those here on the board, (Including Ronald) to give their take on your signature line, but other things have preoccupied me as of late. So here it goes, (and if it needs to be moved to a different section, Mr. Moderator, please do.
[quote:10n5fce0]it is easier for a camel to enter the eye of the needle than a rich man entering heaven[/quote:10n5fce0]February 17, 2009 at 4:25 am #9138
I joined the Catholic Church was not only for Tradition but also it was organized. I used to come from the Reorganized Church of Latter-Day Saints (Now called Community of Christ because they don’t want to be related to the Mormons.) A joke between my brother and I was that we called it the unorganized REorganized church of Latter-day saints. ” title=”Razz” /> (because the church i used to attend had no formal structure.)
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