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hey, i grew up with an evangelical protestant upbringing, and was convinced, but not ignorant that it was right…and that God’s word is the basis of our lives, and is what we should live by alone. but i’ve been reading a lot of posts on this site, and some info on the main page, and i honestly didnt’ know that the bible wasn’t complete until after Jesus’ death. That, and a lot of other things have really made me think. I wouldn’t say i’m quite ready to switch over, but it’s definitely in the back of my mind. one thing i want to ask the moderators especially, is the fact that evangelical faith is largely based on the bible verse where Jesus says, “I am the way, the truth, and the life…[b:202sq78y]no one [/b:202sq78y]gets to the Father but by me.” …What’s the Catholic view of that verse…? because although, like most of you say, the bible alone isn’t the way to go, i would think that atleast much of the bible is legitimate to live a Christian life by, and that seems like a very blunt, clear-cut verse…let me know your thoughts….
I would be glad to answer ctdmsl…
” title=”Smile” /> . As I was once a protestant I know the feeling of discovering that the Bible was not assembled until much later (397 AD at Carthage). This was only the beggining of what begun to bother me.[quote:2i6chm6z]”I am the way, the truth, and the life…no one gets to the Father but by me.” …What’s the Catholic view of that verse…? [/quote:2i6chm6z]
We agree 100% with that statement. We cannot get to God the Father thru:
1. The Pope
2. Mary
3. Saints
But ONLY thru our LORD JESUS CHRIST!!!
As to the roles of the Pope, Mary, and Saints we can discuss that later in time and hopefully clarify any misunderstandings.It is correct that we do not believe in the Bible Alone. We do believe:
1. [b:2i6chm6z]The Bible is Authoritative[/b:2i6chm6z]
2. [b:2i6chm6z]We Need to Study the Scriptures[/b:2i6chm6z]
3. [b:2i6chm6z]The Bible is the Word of God[/b:2i6chm6z]
But we deffinately do not believe in the Bible [b:2i6chm6z]Alone[/b:2i6chm6z]. The Bible needs to be interpreted by someone and that alone is enough to disprove that it’s alone. Not to mention that the Bible itself doesn’t teach [b:2i6chm6z]the Bible Alone[/b:2i6chm6z] doctrine. The early believers went to Church leaders to settle things, they did not open their bibles and start to argue.Hope this helps.
The Least
~Victor
[quote:2m74osxk]one thing i want to ask the moderators especially, is the fact that evangelical faith is largely based on the bible verse where Jesus says, “I am the way, the truth, and the life…[b:2m74osxk]no one [/b:2m74osxk]gets to the Father but by me.” …What’s the Catholic view of that verse…?[/quote:2m74osxk]
From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:[b:2m74osxk]1696[/b:2m74osxk] The way of Christ “leads to life”; a contrary way “leads to destruction.” The Gospel parable of the two ways remains ever present in the catechesis of the Church; it shows the importance of moral decisions for our salvation: “There are two ways, the one of life, the other of death; but between the two, there is a great difference.”
[b:2m74osxk]459 [/b:2m74osxk]The Word became flesh to be our model of holiness: “Take my yoke upon you, and learn from me.” “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father, but by me.” On the mountain of the Transfiguration, the Father commands: “Listen to him!” Jesus is the model for the Beatitudes and the norm of the new law: “Love one another as I have loved you.” This love implies an effective offering of oneself, after his example.
[quote:2m74osxk]because although, like most of you say, the bible alone isn’t the way to go, i would think that atleast much of the bible is legitimate to live a Christian life by, and that seems like a very blunt, clear-cut verse…let me know your thoughts….[/quote:2m74osxk]
Also from the CCC:[b:2m74osxk]103 [/b:2m74osxk]For this reason, the Church has always venerated the Scriptures as she venerates the Lord’s Body. She never ceases to present to the faithful the bread of life, taken from the one table of God’s Word and Christ’s Body.
[b:2m74osxk]104 [/b:2m74osxk]In Sacred Scripture, the Church constantly finds her nourishment and her strength, for she welcomes it not as a human word, “but as what it really is, the word of God”. “In the sacred books, the Father who is in heaven comes lovingly to meet his children, and talks with them.”
[b:2m74osxk]133 [/b:2m74osxk]The Church “forcefully and specifically exhorts all the Christian faithful. . . to learn the surpassing knowledge of Jesus Christ, by frequent reading of the divine Scriptures. Ignorance of the Scriptures is ignorance of Christ.
[b:2m74osxk]135 [/b:2m74osxk]”The Sacred Scriptures contain the Word of God and, because they are inspired, they are truly the Word of God” (DV 24).
[b:2m74osxk]141 [/b:2m74osxk]”The Church has always venerated the divine Scriptures as she venerated the Body of the Lord” (DV 21): both nourish and govern the whole Christian life. “Your word is a lamp to my feet and a light to my path” (Ps 119:105; cf. Is 50:4).
Catholics may not believe in the Bible alone, but we have only the highest views of Sacred Scripture.
[quote:2btuaqmv]hey, i grew up with an evangelical protestant upbringing, and was convinced, but not ignorant that it was right…and that God’s word is the basis of our lives, and is what we should live by alone. but i’ve been reading a lot of posts on this site, and some info on the main page, and i honestly didnt’ know that the bible wasn’t complete until after Jesus’ death. That, and a lot of other things have really made me think. I wouldn’t say i’m quite ready to switch over, but it’s definitely in the back of my mind. one thing i want to ask the moderators especially, is the fact that evangelical faith is largely based on the bible verse where Jesus says, “I am the way, the truth, and the life…[b:2btuaqmv]no one [/b:2btuaqmv]gets to the Father but by me.” …What’s the Catholic view of that verse…? because although, like most of you say, the bible alone isn’t the way to go, i would think that atleast much of the bible is legitimate to live a Christian life by, and that seems like a very blunt, clear-cut verse…let me know your thoughts….[/quote:2btuaqmv]
ctdmsl forgive me for not answering your question (Victor and Benedict already did a great job doing that) but I just want to thank you for the way you asked this very good question.
You see, we Catholics usually get “questions” from protestants that are really intended just to attack and not find out information or the other¬¥s point of view. I guess I should be used to it by now (and most of the time I am) but this last couple of days I have read so many attacks in the form of “questions” by protestants in other Catholic websites that it was starting to get frustating.
That is why it was so refreshing to me to read an actual question (a good one also) intended to really find out information and presented in a respectful manner, so again… Thank You” title=”Very Happy” />Juan
I agree with Juan. As catholics we are bombarded with attacks with people rarely seeking to understand. Thank you ctdmsl…
” title=”Smile” />The Least
~Victor
Peace be with all present!
[quote:22jj2sff]ctdmsl forgive me for not answering your question (Victor and Benedict already did a great job doing that) but I just want to thank you for the way you asked this very good question.
You see, we Catholics usually get “questions” from protestants that are really intended just to attack and not find out information or the other¬¥s point of view. I guess I should be used to it by now (and most of the time I am) but this last couple of days I have read so many attacks in the form of “questions” by protestants in other Catholic websites that it was starting to get frustating.
That is why it was so refreshing to me to read an actual question (a good one also) intended to really find out information and presented in a respectful manner, so again… Thank You [/quote:22jj2sff]Juan I so agree. And thank you ctdmsl for being a “True Seeker”, one who does not judge, but seeks truth and knowledge.
[quote:22jj2sff]”I am the way, the truth, and the life…no one gets to the Father but by me.” …What’s the Catholic view of that verse…? [/quote:22jj2sff]
I believe what ctdmsl is referring to is the custom of calling Priests Father. This is usually what is the passage used to try to disprove the custom. So to help answer this I offer the following:
Father, in the bible, is from the Greek pater, which refers to a person/parent.
Father, as refereed to humans appears 124 times in the N.T. {examples can be provide upon request” title=”Smile” />}
Like a father a priest feeds our spiritual needs and counsels members of his [the priest’s] to lead holy lives
Finally if you take the whole passage into context, not just parts, Matt. 23:9, Jesus reminds us we have only [b:22jj2sff][i:22jj2sff]one[/i:22jj2sff][/b:22jj2sff] heavenly father who is the source of all earthly fatherhood {Exod. 20:3}.The key understanding and replying to these types of questions is the same as we use in law enforcement, the entire context of the statement must be used and understood. Fragments are partial truths not whole truths.
[quote:22jj2sff]because although, like most of you say, the bible alone isn’t the way to go, i would think that atleast much of the bible is legitimate to live a Christian life by, and that seems like a very blunt, clear-cut verse…let me know your thoughts….[/quote:22jj2sff]
This is known as Sola Scriptura and it can be dangerous. Without studding the Scriptures, prayer, learning the textual bases (ie. Greek, Latin, Aramaic) we cannot have a firm doctrinal foundation. This very evident in faiths that practice Sola Scriptura.
For help in understanding this more I suggest some lite reading Sola Scriptura[/url:22jj2sff]. It’s a short paperback and a good read.
Also for further question on the faith I would suggest The Catholic Response[/url:22jj2sff]. This too is a good short read and a paperback. I answers many question about some of our most debate, by non-Catholics, customs and beliefs.
I hope I have helped in some way and would love to help more in the future, “…Always be ready to give an explanation to anyone who ask you for a reason for your hope, but do it with gentleness and reference…” 1Peter 3:15-16
You know, brothers and sisters in Christ, this is the reason that I post here so much. I also have an account at some other Catholic websites, because of my belief that there is a great potential for healing and understanding going on. I joke about being a “PresboCatholotarian,” but it is much more than a joke. I too have seen the rabid attack Protestants on the other sites, and I find it embarrassing.
BUT! There’s a guy that contacted me through CHN, fer instance, and I am hopeful that we can get a Presbyterain-Catholic friendship going, just like I’ve found here.
I think we all agree that these are rough times, and worrying about praying “to” saints and the justification/sanctification split or lack of same is best accomplished as conversation between those that disagree but choose to do something radical — love each other.
I don’t see where we’re left much choice, scripturally. Like the RCC did in recent history (asking forgiveness of the Jews) I think it is high time that we turn to each other with a respect and mutual cherishing, and, yes, forgiveness, attitudes that just haven’t been there as much as they should have been in the past. We protestants are too guilty of chasing you Papists around with tracts and the KJV for my taste, frankly. Time to quit.
Time to get over it and stop arguing. Let the world of the nonbelievers see us forging deep bonds that don’t ignore our differences but has a celebratory charity, and who knows what could happen?
I don’t believe that we need to fret over differences as much as we need to emphasize our connection through the same Saviour. That’s why I come here, guys, and I appreciate the gentleness and patience you’ve shown when I give voice to our differing perspectives. I don’t come here to be converted, nor to convert — we’re already converted. I come here to share our wonderful Saviour, gain some understanding, contribute and enjoy. I hope to continue, and trust that you do as well, and, although I got a bit off-topic, this was a good excuse to point out that you guys are just fun to hang around with. It brings out the best in me. I think it just may be true of others, too.
Okay, well, brings out the best, except for the time I laid into the person that said we were being judgemental with the LDS folks. I’m a south Richmond redneck, after all, and I can be expected to get a bit rowdy every so often!
Elkabong, I confess to you as a brother in Christ that this is not isolated in protestant communities. Catholics also are uncharitable in their approach.
My only point is that catholics spend [b:39u12ds5]most[/b:39u12ds5] all their time on defense from attacks from outsiders. Misunderstandings are to be expected. Attacks without wanting to understand is another story.Even if I do agree with catholics I would caution them in their approach. This is after all, one of the reasons why I said “don’t forget to love” in another post. Please forgive me if you took this as more then just an honest observation…..
I will extend charity to you and all as long as I am on this earth. As Corithians says that without Love you have nothing. No matter how right you are.
One of my goals coming into the RCC (although I confess I haven’t always done a good job) is to change the tone of dialogue between both Catholic and non-catholic alike. Extending love toward neighbor.
God alone knows our hearts.
~Victor
i appreciate the kind words, guys…sorry i’m late getting back, i check out the site quite often, but sometimes i forget what boards i’ve posted on! so i can’t always find my posts and see what you guys had to say. but yes, i am just seeking the truth, and respect everyone’s opinions. religion is such a huge realm of facts and myths, and it’s impossible for anyone to know everything. i’m running a lot of things through my mind, and trying to filter through it all. Like i said, i am a protestant, but i’m not ignorant enough to say “i’m right, you’re wrong!” anyway, i look forward to learning more about the catholic faith!
” title=”Smile” /> . As I was once a protestant I know the feeling of discovering that the Bible was not assembled until much later (397 AD at Carthage). This was only the beggining of what begun to bother me.
” title=”Very Happy” />
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